FrontEngineDragsters.Org Forum
Drag Racing Discussions => Altereds => Topic started by: Defiance on February 23, 2014, 05:10:50 PM
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Just changed my Altered steering from a rack and pinion to a Strange Altered box and Mark Williams steering setup kit. The car is a 116 inch wheel base with 10 degrees caster, zero camber and 1/8 toe. Took the car to the track and immediately had a violant front wheel wobble. Never had it with the rack. Any thoughts on where to look for the problem?
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Just changed my Altered steering from a rack and pinion to a Strange Altered box and Mark Williams steering setup kit. The car is a 116 inch wheel base with 10 degrees caster, zero camber and 1/8 toe. Took the car to the track and immediately had a violant front wheel wobble. Never had it with the rack. Any thoughts on where to look for the problem?
See if you can contact http://www.frontenginedragsters.org/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=262 Don a member here. He had the same problem. I did send him an e-mail to see if he could help you.
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Thanks for the POC. I will contact him and see if he can assist.
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With only 10 in the kingpin, I would run 1/4 toe & use a Honda MC steering damper.
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going foward or backing up??
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Going forward.
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had this on an altered, it was in my view a culmination of play in the whole steering assembley, exaggerated in my case by fitting taller rear tires and losing some castor. Kingpin bushes had some play, rods ends were old, and steering box had some play too. It all gets magnified back at the wheel, i used to get it coming out of a rolling burnout (off the pedal)
There is a technical description as to why it happens and it's related to the gyroscopic effect a spnning wheel has but I've not delved into that too much. A damper does mask the problem, but make sure all steering components are as they should be, and the wheels / tires are balanced up and pressures evenly matched.
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Can I ask why you switched from a rack to a box.
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Had two issues. Too many joints in the steering shaft causing excessive play. Secondly, the rack would always oversteer when I made a correction.
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Thanks. I bought a Spitzer Altered with a rack in it. It does have a lot of joints but didn't feel loose. Hopefully it feels ok when I get it running.
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Thanks for everybod's input. In particular, thanks to S&W Racing. We spent a lot of their time discussing this issue. Their input and willingness to help goes above and beyond. A top notch, truly professional orgonization. Bottom line, is we discovered our pitman arm was too long. Secondly, we added a steering stabilizer and moved the location of the steering box. Although we have not done a test and tune, I will make a few passes this weekend before Coastal Plains has their big race. Ill keep everybody posted on the results. Again, thank you.
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Thanks. I bought a Spitzer Altered with a rack in it. It does have a lot of joints but didn't feel loose. Hopefully it feels ok when I get it running.
U should be OK.
My Spitzer has s rack, with multiple uni joints and it has gone into the 7.20's @ over 180mph.
Steers real nice.
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Thanks. I bought a Spitzer Altered with a rack in it. It does have a lot of joints but didn't feel loose. Hopefully it feels ok when I get it running.
U should be OK.
My Spitzer has s rack, with multiple uni joints and it has gone into the 7.20's @ over 180mph.
Steers real nice.
Can I ask what your car has for a steering wheel? Mine has a D shaped wheel. I haven't been down the track yet but it feels like it's going to steer too quick.
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It also has a small D shaped wheel.
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Not so good news. Was getting the car ready for T&T. Lost oil pressure. Checked the oil and found metal. Looks like ill be missing a few races. Update will have to come later.
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Not good news. Keep us updated.
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Honda MC steering damper.
Good advice. I use VW one. Instant cure. Large wheels (tall) once they begin to wobble want to stay wobbling. If you ever played with a toy gryo as a kid you may remember this . Another good experiment is with a bicycle wheel. Spin it the give it a quick jerk and it will want to repeat that jerk constantly for a bit. I learned this back in the 70s with a 32 Bantam altered. Some people think that adding a damper is a crutch. I suppose it could be but when everything is right it is often still required. Just like the shock absorber tells the wheel on a bump, "Ok you got to do that once but that is enough" the damper does exactly the same for steering. My rail was Ok on very smooth tracks but even sometimes on the return road if I hit a big bump or the curbing it would do start its dance. Didn't bother me as at high speed it was perfect. When I switched to airfield racing some of the old wartime airfields are not that smooth and it would do its dance if I hit a pavement seam on a burnout. I only let the world see that once. I installed the Moog VW beetle damper the following monday . That was several years ago now. Installation on my car took about 1/2 hour complete. BTW I don't run the huge caster. Only 3.1/2degrees. And my car as anyone who has seen it run or driven it will tell you runs like it was on rails. Anyway Many production vehicles with a solid front axle have the damper installed in production. Old VW Beetles, Some Jeeps, All GM 4wd trucks etc. Try it, you will like it.
don
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years ago, had same issue when chassis unloaded in the lights. tie rod was severely bent. car has dropped I beam and transverse leaf with 14 degrees of caster. goes very straight but hard to steer at slow speed. put on a VW steering dampner from a super beetle. solved the issue completely