FrontEngineDragsters.Org Forum
Drag Racing Discussions => Drag Racing => Topic started by: noslin on September 09, 2016, 09:35:17 PM
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reading the Powerglide Transmission Handbook they were talking about burnouts. they recommended starting out with small ones and increase to come up with what your car wants concerning tire heat.
i think/know as the day goes along the track is hotter and i imagine ?? you would do a shorter burnout.
so, do some of you guys just burnout till it feels good or do you actually take a methodical approach and get a certain tire temp or shoot for one?
what is a tire temp you would shoot for?
ty
dean
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I just hit the throttle and let out sometime!
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Paul said it all. Let her rip !
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Never raced against a Powerglide transmission handbook before.
Todays track surface and prep only require the tire to be clean for adheasion, Burnouts are more for engine temp control, stuck in the lanes for a bit , and you might need build some heat in the engine during the burnout, because they are not going to let you sit behind the line waiting for heat to build while the other guy has the top bulb lit.
Raced a guy that was known for doing full track BO's, waited to fire (WB guy yelling at me to fire) untill the the guy was comming back. fired, and BO to about 300', started to back up at the same time he was next to us. Both cars left hard and hooked up. ZERO difference in 60's, the only difference is that he does not pay for his own tires.
The name of the game is consistencey (ZERO CO$T) what ever you do it the same every time
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Rookie question: always in top gear, right?
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Rookie question: always in top gear, right?
Yes!
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Rookie question: always in top gear, right?
Yes!
Thanks Paul!
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Yes, high gear always. This how we do burn-outs, and why; I have our driver pull thru the water box, and just out of the water, enough so the tires are still wet and stop, [stopping will make for a better smokey B-O], until I give him the signal to go. Be carefull there is no water after the water box, ie stop out of the wet, but hopefully with the tires still wet. Don't burn-out past the tree, and get out of the throttle if the tires hook up, it's not so good for the converter to dead hook the slicks. If one of the reasons for the B-O is to heat up the tires, a long B-O will cool the tires coming back. I look for burn-out tire temps to be at least 10°+ above the track temp, that's why the B-O tire temp as we are backing up will vary. One thing I do is use a kids sidewall chalk to mark [X] on the B-O track, so we will be alot more consistant backing up in the B-O track, and we back up almost to the wet, so if we don't get the car on the mark [X] I can give him the signal on how much to move over, as his his pulling into the stage beams. Also the driver has enough room to test the transbrake as he's coming up to the stage beams.
Another thing I have used is when the track is HOT, like over 130°, make shorter B-O, & I have him back-up next to the B-O tracks, the track is already too hot. Which means I line-up the B-O off center of the grove.
I hope this Helps,
Jon
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Never raced against a Powerglide transmission handbook before.
thanks for the humor if thats what it is.... i'd figure the keyboard would be to easy so i thought i would try reading a book; it even has pictures which right my ally. Nevertheless, this is all new to me and even though i just did turn 54 i still thought it to be a valid question. im trying to read, ask questions and learn and obviously there are others in the same boat.
i had no idea on burning out in high gear either. i know on my trans in the bug, we would do 3rd and 4th gear b/o and also would not burnout till it grabbed for similar reasons (bad for the gear or hub).
Another thing I have used is when the track is HOT, like over 130°, make shorter B-O, & I have him back-up next to the B-O tracks, the track is already too hot. Which means I line-up the B-O off center of the grove.
50/50 or completely adjacent to b/o track?
concerning testing the transbrake, before staging, just put it on the brake i take it and hit the limiter?
what would be the desired engine temp range. how long does it usually take your motor to build temp. if you are sitting in the lanes for some time, do you still wait to roll out of the stage lanes and then light it up or would you light it up in the lanes say a car ahead? i can see on a nitro car waiting till the last second as if they had to shut down they would be screwed..
everyones responses are helpful, ty for the input.
ty
dean
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For me, I found that driving thru the water box a slow speed keeps my burnouts from going crooked.
Also, I hit the throttle to raise the rpm's fast then taper back when I feel the slicks are spinning, and, immediately lift when I feel them start to grab, still remember the days of ballooning a converter.
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I know it is not needed, but always been a fan of a smokey burn out
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For me, I found that driving thru the water box a slow speed keeps my burnouts from going crooked.
Also, I hit the throttle to raise the rpm's fast then taper back when I feel the slicks are spinning, and, immediately lift when I feel them start to grab, still remember the days of ballooning a converter.
That's how we do it.
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Rookie question: always in top gear, right?
I start mine in 1st and shift to second as soon as tires start to spin and let up before they grab. I was told starting out in second can be tough on the clutch pack. And staying in to long tough on the sprag.
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Start in high and stay there, no shift, get out of it before the tires grab, it should take very little throttle to spin the tires, note the blades in the bird catcher are barely open and I do not have a lot of power (I am a 8.000 second 1/4 mile dragster, top speed is usually around 165),
The first shot is the very start of the burn out, and the scond one I have move 50 feet down the track, and still the blades are barely open. You should not have to use much throttle to spin the tires.
Both shots are of the same burnout
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With todays tires and track prep a long burnout is just extra abuse on engine and tires burned up quicker.Bad part a big someky burnout to half track is freaking fun as all get out.I loved burnout in the alky car.Roll thru water roll into throttle and burn till your heart was content or billfold was bitting at your butt.
Limiting burnout with this new deal is something I will have to do not what I want to do.
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Your right, new tire technology and good track prep means a smoky burn out is not needed,
They are fun.
I do not think they are that hard on the equipment, you are just cracking the throttle, tires are spinning because of low traction.
I generally just go to the tree (before the tires grab) and get out of it, but then do not brake very hard and end up a ways out.
I back quickly, and generally turn the first bulb on first.
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Smoky burn outs are not needed but sure look good in a pic(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160928/26412bbdd3e2c70597e3b6daacd341f5.jpg)
Or in color
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160928/b8c3e4a93dd0d63cac951fc272e529b4.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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notice on pauls burn-out the effect of matching wheel width to tire width and how the tire crowns and the center heats more than the outside edges. If the rim was 10" wide and the tire 12" tread, the sidewalls would be square to the rim and the tire surface flat across getting an even wear and heat.
As always, do what works best for you and your set-up
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So should I be running a narrower wheel than what the tire manufacturer states? I have always just used what they recommended
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A temp gun across slick after burnout would tell you I would think
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So should I be running a narrower wheel than what the tire manufacturer states? I have always just used what they recommended
The tire manuf gave you a range of wheel widths that will work safely with the tire and not what would yield the best performance.
Your tire on a wide rim is trying to pull the tire beads off the wheel rim and the edges are not in contact with the track.
On my pic, where the 12" tire is on a 10" rim shows the sidewalls square with the rim and a flat tire crown with full tread contact with the track and even temp across the surface.
Now should you change wheels, no- if what you have works for you, But given the choice when buying a new pair of rear wheels, the better move is to purchase a set that are 2" narrower then the tread width
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The tires I have are the GoodYear D2070 they only show to be run on a 14" wheel but maybe in the future if I can round up a set of 12" rims I will give it a whirl
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Thats a lot of tire to carry for a front engine dragster. If you look at the tread color and smoke pattern you are not using the full width of the tread anyway, so why carry it??
If this combo works for you and you are happy with it---GREAT, but I would never recommend this to one of my customers based on years and years of building and running winning dragsters
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I just watched what the A/fuel cars ran and for the most part the cars I saw were running 14"-14.5" I know Bates runs a 12" tire and it works. This tire works for me so I will continue to run them if I had a set of 33x12's to try I would give them a weekend and see but these work. Thanks Bruce