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Social => Your Builds / Photo Gallery => Topic started by: LZ on January 22, 2015, 07:32:47 PM

Title: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on January 22, 2015, 07:32:47 PM
Hello all:
Will try to keep this short .........  Loved Drag racing as long as I can remember. MY one(late) Brother set me straight on music and my other Brother got me into Drag racing. One day he took me to the late great  Niagara dragstrip in 67. I saw my first Fiat Altered and it forever engrained into my life. Met a close friend (Frontenginedragsters)in Grades school and he loved it as much as I do and it bonds us till this day.
Started on my beloved Fiat project several years ago and a lot has changed since then. Last year I got to a point were knew had to make a change .  Thus started my search for a car that was near done and get my aging ass out to the track and stop screwing around. Searched Craigslist and racing junk religiously several times a day everyday for either a different Altered or a FED. 6 months later...... Bingo one morning it showed up and things happened fast. Its a Newstalgia FED and will make some people groan, But its mine and Im gonna have fun. ;)
I build stuff for a living so was bound and determined to build my own car. Buying a near ready to go car and somebody else s build is really tearing me up. But this is the sacrifice that must be made to get out soon.  :-\
It does free up time to do a couple things to the engine build that have been thinking about for quit awhile. We will see where this journey ends up. Goal is to get car out this year to at least get license and tuning runs in. Its doable but theres a lot of things out of my control.
So now that I have completely bored you, let me introduce you to  "the Prisoner"

BCinU
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: ricardo1967 on January 23, 2015, 05:30:09 AM
Nice introduction LZ. That's a bitchin looking FED!

Decades ago I started building my FED from scratch as well, but at that pace it would take me an eternity to complete it. I put that build on hold when a friend showed me an ad with pretty much the car I had in mind.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Oldboy on January 23, 2015, 06:55:27 AM
Good looking car LZ, is that Don Kanka's S&W 'Jersey Junior Fueler' ?
I wondered what had become of Don's project, he had some health issues I believe.
Hope you enjoy the car it looks like a good build, what motor you gonna run?
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: coupemerc on January 23, 2015, 08:34:35 AM
Nice piece! I seem to remember S&W using that car in promotions for their chassis shop. I think it was set up with a stack injected BBC. Best of luck!
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Frontenginedragsters on January 24, 2015, 05:03:08 AM
 Can't wait to get this to the track. Its been along time coming.
The kids are grown and its time to play.
When the Prisoner hits the track all the others in the village will take notice!
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on January 24, 2015, 05:20:56 PM
Hi guys and thanks:

Yes oldboy bought this from Captain Kanka. He says hes in process of having S&W build an Altered. Got the opportunity to buy him lunch when we picked up car. Nice guy wish I had more time to hear some of his exploits. Funny.
Going to have a 331 Whale with a Glide behind.

Hi Chuck: Yes S&W had this car on a couple of there promotions. I did not even realize it till I had car home. He was running a BBC with a glide.

Don and Scott did a nice job on the car. Its a little strange as Scott passed just a couple days after our phone handshake deal for this. Still a little shocked when I open the Barn door and see this. How blessed I am to have a supportive family for this madness and great friends. Measurements, plans and some fab work is starting. If something looks interesting will post it.

In case anyone is wondering what Frontenginedragsters and I are talking about. The name comes from an old BBC show we both love. Its fitting as when you get wrapped up in Drag Racing you are a Prisoner. There is no escape. :o

Working the Engine plate now. Lots of measuring and writing notes, checking parts , planning ahead, you know the usual.  Hoping to have Engine in place in next few weeks so can start the layout work.  Then get it back out to start the machine work etc.
If I am boring y'all or if you want some other detail and such please let me know. Just as excited as heck about this and  probobly rambling on sorry.
Thank you
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: janjon on January 24, 2015, 05:46:41 PM
Ramble on, Luke; we will avidly follow!

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: jimc on January 24, 2015, 06:22:13 PM
Hi Luke

Thats a real nice ride!! I saw that at Island a couple years back. He was having tuning issues that day. Good luck with it. I'm in NJ, and coordinate for The Southern Slingshots northern division.

Jim Cummings
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on January 24, 2015, 06:30:59 PM
Hi Luke

Thats a real nice ride!! I saw that at Island a couple years back. He was having tuning issues that day. Good luck with it. I'm in NJ, and coordinate for The Southern Slingshots northern division.

Jim Cummings

Really:
Wow Jim cool.   Do you have a schedule, plans or any info you could share? Thats really neat . Wish we could have something like that around here. Love to follow you guys
thanks
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on January 24, 2015, 08:26:41 PM
NDRL is a series you might want to look into
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on January 25, 2015, 06:18:10 AM
NDRL is a series you might want to look into

Oops , no Glenn my bad choice of words. By follow I mean watch a race, talk to somebody or watch any posts online. Im a looong way from heading to any race.
NDRL is a great group.
c ya
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: ricci32 on January 25, 2015, 01:56:30 PM
Love the car luke

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: jimc on January 26, 2015, 12:15:11 PM
Luke
Where are you located? We have a schedule posted for now and prob. add to it as the year moves on.

Jim
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on January 26, 2015, 01:13:12 PM
Luke
Where are you located? We have a schedule posted for now and prob. add to it as the year moves on.

Jim

Have you added the schedule to our calendar here?
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: jimc on January 26, 2015, 05:40:51 PM
Glen where would I put it?

Jim
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on January 26, 2015, 05:41:58 PM
Love the car luke

Larry:
Your the Fugitive and we are the Prisoner. Make sure to send a cake with a file....LOL
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on January 26, 2015, 05:49:44 PM
Jim:
I see the dates in Ohio and PA. Is that some of the Northern chapter schedule your talking about?
http://southernslingshots.com/protected_ssgshed.html

Niiiiice. 8)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: jimc on January 27, 2015, 04:52:27 AM
Those are them! We have Pittsburgh in late Sept and VMP in early Oct.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: slofomoco on January 27, 2015, 08:08:24 PM
Nice car Luke!
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on February 12, 2015, 04:09:34 AM
Well a little update. Not going to get into MF'ing a company but just to throw this out there.
Thought to save time would just buy a Hemi to glide Engine plate with an SFI Flexplate. Figured the couple hundred extra would buy me a few hours of labor savings. Wrong.  :-\ 
First off contacted company before ordering and asked a few questions like. To make sure the adapter was as in picture and located the flexplate on outside of crank flange.  Confirmed by 2 people that it did and its just as picture showed. Also what starter is used and anything special to understand when ordering converter.
Doing a floor check found:

- They sent a bushing that located the flex plate off the rough drilled center hole on crank. What happened to the correct adapter like they said was in kit? For kicks and giggles figured to get some numbers. When I indicated the center hole it ran out over .008 on crank. When said bushing is tapped in place it runs out .009.

 - The flex plate has .005 slop fitting to this said adapter bushing.

How we doing so far?  Now the coup de grace.

 - Put the starter in the pocket to check mesh.    Nope the starter gears had about .050 in interference from 0 mesh.
 - Put a glide case on to see about alignment from Crank CL to powerglide CL. Now if something is amiss here please let me know but indicated from crank to the pump bore. Loaded my indicator by .030 and when I swung around to other side ( indicator face was facing bell housing ) just lookin at indicator tip could visibly see  about .020 gap from tip to bore.  :o :o :o. Didnt have enough indicator travel to get a full read. 

At this point its discussed ( Matt and I) that this thing is going back.

Anyone have some data they could share on acceptable tolerances with respect to the trans alignment.  Its no wonder I have seen people having issues with pump seal leaks, pump breakage, converters loosening up. 
If you think about these interfaces and tolerance stack up. Its asking a lot for something going to spin up as much as it will.

So just some info please share your thoughts.  Dont be shy. ;)

Material being ordered , moving on
thank you
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: dreracecar on February 12, 2015, 09:00:38 AM
Post pics of these parts, I have done 6 of these plates 392-Chevy and no complaints
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Van on February 12, 2015, 09:28:36 AM
I made the very first one of these adaptors way back in the late 70's.  I had bought Gene Adams's A/F fed   & decided I wanted to run a auto trans. I made my adaptor plate & flywheel very crude but it was the best I could do with the tools at hand. I never sold one but later when Dave Tuttle (CCE) built his FED  he asked to copy it, I loaned him my Super Comp motor and adaptor & he made up a more accurate one & ran my motor until his motor was finished. I would think anyone with a good mill could make up a very nice one.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on February 12, 2015, 02:41:34 PM
Post pics of these parts, I have done 6 of these plates 392-Chevy and no complaints
Hi Bruce:
Ya the whole intention was to buy a commercial adapter and just cut it for the chassis. Save precious time, how did that work out.  So screw it doing what I should have done to begin with and just make one.
In the photos I zeroed the indicator and moved the item 180 for a TIR. The one shows the slop in the Flexplate and the other shows the runout on the crank. Kills me how sloppy the fit is from the flex plate to adapter.
The other photo if you stare I tried to get a good contrast showing the root ( dark area ) of the starter gear. If you stare through the ring gear and see the root of the starter gear, you can visual the difference. Didn't bother measuring but you can see about .050-.06  ish to zero mesh. If you take into account the mesh clearance the starter is off center by about near .090 WAG.

Thank you for taking your valuable time to herd the Cats... ;)

Luke

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: dreracecar on February 12, 2015, 04:30:13 PM
Usually the adpt plates I make are 2-piece because I am replacing an existing .250" motor plate. The main plate it bored for the crank hole and the Chevy dowels and the 392 dowels.Then I make and attach an trimmed collar locating on the Chevy dowels using some 10/32 flat head bolts. From that point I drill and countersink the 392 flange  holes and drill and tap the Chevy for studs. doing it this way allows for extra material to make the crank OD register on the flexplate.
Great news, I have a customer with this type of flexplate/flywheel that wants to sell it, Came on a car he bought. It has been run before(couple runs) and is in great condition. I will PM you his Number.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Frontenginedragsters on April 10, 2015, 06:40:34 AM
Spring is trying to break thru a record cold global warming in February.
Number 6 [Luke] left the village for the month of March for work leave. [another global warming cold month]
Our local track opens in a week.......Weather permitting.
Work on the power plant and drive line for the Prisoner will resume soon.
Luke should be posting updates in the next few weeks.

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on June 10, 2015, 05:56:44 PM
Well Howdy all:
These past few months have flown by. Not anywhere near where I hoped to be but it is what it is.
So after scoping out our blocks this dirty little guy here is the one. 354 , Pressure tested  AOK, Striped and on its way for thermal cleaning. When back will start . Its been sitting a Loooong time.
Have to say. Have been giving thought to different avenues last few months to get this car out. Here this little Hemi will be seeing much work to whip it into something that will hold up to its use. It makes most common sense to just put a BBC into the Prisoner as it was built for. But just cant do it. I am a Ford guy through and through but am not a Car Nazi and appreciate all makes. Could for all the work this will take, just buy a nice SVO block and have nice thick Decks, 5 bolts per cylinder Thick cylinder walls , More cubes, etc, etc. and it came dang close. But off the little hemi goes and it starts.
Ford guy putting a Hemi together :o ::) :P ;)....
With picking a path forward I will be selling some extra Hemi stuff when I can get it rounded up if anyone's interested. Will make a list and get it on the for sale section hopefully, in a few weeks.
Thanks much to Proformance Specialties.
Thanks
Luke

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1076_zpssdowmcky.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1076_zpssdowmcky.jpg.html)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on June 19, 2015, 06:31:28 PM
Well the block came back and time to introduce the Prisoner to his cell mate.
 I had added in the Hemi dowel locations on the original plate so could get the block in car for preemptive measurements, plans and such. It was gratifying in a small way to see the 2 together finally even being a quick mocked up way.
Everything looks fine , I will have good measurements to start planning a pan, oil pump mounting etc, etc.
Buuuut one thing did come up to bite me, and that always is the way.
The headers wont fit. I have a real nice set of Dan Olsen Zoomies that will be on the market real soon. Oh well that's how these roll.
Did pause for minute thinking about an SVO block again ;)
Endeavor to persevere.....
Have a nice weekend everyone
Luke
Oh the Donovan head is on there to bust the balls.

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/100_2344_zpsdg8lldis.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/100_2344_zpsdg8lldis.jpg.html)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on June 20, 2015, 06:14:16 AM
Steve had header clearance problems, they were able to solve the problem, check with him?
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on June 24, 2015, 04:35:00 AM
Steve had header clearance problems, they were able to solve the problem, check with him?

Hi Glenn:
Ya Matt was telling me about it.
This has taken on  life of its own. This really blindsided me was considering a lot of other things not this. Have been measuring and sketching as time allowed this week. There is a plan in place and that is adapter plates.  Sort of like high port plates on a 351 C  going back to old pro stock days.
This all stems from the very obtuse angle on the Hemi head exhaust side.
Am laying that out now just deciding on what exhaust pattern to adapt to. was looking at Donovan 417 initially but am also considering a 426 pattern as this makes it available to use 426 headers. Also looking at a Brad Anderson 6/8 as it has a nice port design that looks like it will blend in well to match a modified stock hemi port.  Sorta kinda. ??? There is also Flanges available if I try to save time and not fab my own.
Time is everything as Matt and I always joke the hour glass sand just keeps getting shorter. ;D

This has halted any further progress on starting of the block work. Not going to proceed until I am absolutely positive that this will work and not be some mucky mess.
The next alternative plan if this fails is abandon the old hemi and go to another combination. We'll see.
Trying to get this figured out with post haste as I wont be able to work on car most of July.
OK sorry for rambling carry on nothing to see here
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on August 14, 2015, 06:58:28 PM
Hi all:
Well an update, sure you were waiting with baited breath. ::) ;)
So with great sadness I am selling all the Hemi stuff and the Prisoner is going to get a 385 series Ford of some combination. Have been working a list and photos of the Hemi items for sale. Will post on this site first for your consideration.
Needless to say with work and family commitments the car will not see the track this year. :-X We will work as best we can, Will update when something substantial is worth reporting.
On a side note there is another FED in our group coming together and is close to hitting track. Will try to get some photos and info this week and start a thread.

thank you 
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on August 14, 2015, 09:29:46 PM
Is Matt's dragster going to hit the track?

I find it hard to believe you could not get the Hemi to fit?????????
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on August 16, 2015, 07:40:56 AM
Is Matt's dragster going to hit the track?

I find it hard to believe you could not get the Hemi to fit?????????
Ya I know right??!! :o
I can get it to work but the time involved making the high port plates, Headers , new steering rod,etc, it just wasn't worth it to me.
Next car is going to be a Funny car anyway.  ;)
hope your backs better c ya Glenn.
LZ
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Frontenginedragsters on August 16, 2015, 01:27:49 PM
The next dragster to hit the burnout box will be the red FED for John Shaff. Coming along with help from friends.
My car goes for chassis modifications this fall.
Luke FED will be out the summer of 2016.
Things take time when you have no time.

Matt
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on October 28, 2015, 07:45:10 PM
Have you hugged your racecar engine today??? ::)


(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1404_zpswn7iw288.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1404_zpswn7iw288.jpg.html)

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on November 26, 2015, 08:45:23 AM
Hey everybody Glenn doesn't have a general BS section so putting it here.
With that Our Family and the Prisoner crew wish you all a very Happy Thanksgiving. For those going through life issues we hope for your best outcome and wish strength for you .
Thanks all
Luke

Oh by way Prisoner powertrain parts are coming in.
 ;D
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on November 26, 2015, 10:17:49 AM
Hey everybody Glenn doesn't have a general BS section so putting it here.
With that Our Family and the Prisoner crew wish you all a very Happy Thanksgiving. For those going through life issues we hope for your best outcome and wish strength for you .
Thanks all
Luke

Oh by way Prisoner powertrain parts are coming in.
 ;D

And a very HAPPY THANKSGIVING to you as well
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on December 13, 2015, 06:51:55 PM
A Ford in that thar thang.....
The Prisoner meets its power.
Its only a Template Engine plate. As mentioned in previous posts the Chevy plate that came with car was off center from rear.
Didn't feel I had good enough dimensions to just cut a 100 dollar pc of plate. So its a temporary one to check the adjusted dimensions calculated and I am going to do a repeatability check on the rear by doing an R and R. A feel good if you will that alls well.
Had these parts sitting around and just had to take a moment ,to take a look see, get a giggle.
The intake the injector is atop is of a new composite design that molecularly changes the Alky to Nitro and is good for 2 tenths.. :P :P :P
Luke
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1552_zpsoxpqtywr.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1552_zpsoxpqtywr.jpg.html)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: ricardo1967 on December 13, 2015, 07:25:34 PM
A Ford in that thar thang.....
The Prisoner meets its power.
Its only a Template Engine plate. As mentioned in previous posts the Chevy plate that came with car was off center from rear.
Didn't feel I had good enough dimensions to just cut a 100 dollar pc of plate. So its a temporary one to check the adjusted dimensions calculated and I am going to do a repeatability check on the rear by doing an R and R. A feel good if you will that alls well.
Had these parts sitting around and just had to take a moment ,to take a look see, get a giggle.
The intake is of a new composite design that molecularly changes the Alky to Nitro and is good for 2 tenths.. :P :P :P
Luke

Looking great, hey that's a turkey catcher!
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on December 13, 2015, 08:18:31 PM
Intake looks like Steve"s, NICE
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Frontenginedragsters on December 16, 2015, 05:11:02 PM
 You are straying from the norm. You should have a rear engine dragster with a B B Chevy and a carburetor.
Tell us more about this FED with a big block Ford and a "Shotgun" injector.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on December 16, 2015, 05:21:31 PM
You are straying from the norm. You should have a rear engine dragster with a B B Chevy and a carburetor.
Tell us more about this FED with a big block Ford and a "Shotgun" injector.
Hey was thinking. Would any info off this help with your front half fit up??
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Frontenginedragsters on December 31, 2015, 02:53:00 PM
Happy Birthday Luke  ;D
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on February 14, 2016, 09:24:58 AM
OMG a progress report. :o
So with talk over Engine Dimensions ,what were looking for-hope to accomplish for the last few weeks. The cam was ordered yesterday here we go.
Very good people  http://www.bulletcams.com
Matt has had a few Engines out there with great success with these cams. Kind of hard for him being an Engle loyalist but times change.
Biggest issue I have right now is that the car is set up with a 9 inch Strange 12 bolt center section combination.
The highest pro gear available for a 12 bolt is 4:11. When a 3:89 will be more desirable to get the engine at a more livable RPM.
I have 4:33's in it now on a 31 inch Good Year (Jon we will be talking)
With just getting car out getting it and driver straightened out this would be acceptable right now as won't be making any 1/4 mile passes till ready.
But wanking it and looking at big picture my hope is to get this car Nostalgia Eliminator ready ultimatly. Hey a guy can dream can't he?? But mostly in our instance this car is just for fun and our local track bracket race. Lots of test and tune nights for our deal.
Am at point now of fabbing Engine plates. It seems I ultimately have to put a 9" center section in it to get the desired GR.  The 9" hypoid is .75 lower then a 12 bolt. Sooooo I have to lower engine accordingly. This will eat into the precious time and money coffee can.
Paths forward are either:
- Live with 4:33 which will get us through initial shakedowns this year getting car out faster.
    -Then either change to the 4:11 and taller tire eventually.  Not really my favorite thought at this moment especially if the 4:11's are not nominal
- Changing to the 9" straight away and not having to remake engine plates and what ever little thing pops up.
Along all this is the thought of starting line ratio and torque convertor.
Pretty much answered my thoughts typing this out.  :-\
Jon if you're reading this what kind of tire growth do you think you get with a D2585 on a 12 inch wheel? Im not thinking much ???
Will see where this ends up and let y'all know so not to make same mistakes I make.
Thanks guys . 
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: masracingtd1167 on February 14, 2016, 11:49:15 AM
If you have to buy tires I think Jon also has the 1288 goodyears that are 12x33 that are a very good tire for a FED .
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on February 18, 2016, 06:57:41 PM
If you have to buy tires I think Jon also has the 1288 goodyears that are 12x33 that are a very good tire for a FED .
Thanks Bill yes that is another item to use in equation.   :-\ 
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on February 18, 2016, 07:01:31 PM
Well doing a little to emulate one of my heroes Pete Robinson........  yum yom yom

.
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1752_zpsfuwus8x7.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1752_zpsfuwus8x7.jpg.html)

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Van on February 18, 2016, 07:42:55 PM
That's how I do mine. I go down the side and eliminate the mount bosses & also cut the screw in freeze plugs to flush. I use a ball end mill and cut in small steps as I go down the sides in rows, then finish up with a hand grinder to make the sides smooth. 
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on February 28, 2016, 08:01:25 AM
So the Pistons and Rods are on order , the Prisoner team is proud to support such a fine drag racing company.
Will be thinking of Joe P as we load the soldiers.

http://www.venolia.com

B seein you.
 ;)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on March 05, 2016, 05:07:58 PM
Hello all:
Block pretty much deburred. Made up some plugs for valley casting holes.
Good enough to start machining and final deburr afterwards.

Going to give it a tickle on the line hone next. Main Bores measured good but not happy with the finish.

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1757_zpsyrzsl5gq.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1757_zpsyrzsl5gq.jpg.html)

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1759_zpstw6zq3ps.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1759_zpstw6zq3ps.jpg.html)

 :)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Van on March 06, 2016, 05:59:32 PM
 When capping those holes it's a real good idea to drill drain backs in the front to aid in getting oil back to the pan. Hyflow  Dynamics web site has pics of the mod and others,
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on June 05, 2016, 10:09:37 AM
Hello friends and hope all are having a great year so far.
Nice to see some new people and cars coming aboard.
So anyway a little update on the Prisoner.
The cam is here.
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1763_zps3ww1zry9.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1763_zps3ww1zry9.jpg.html)

and a shot of pistons and rods from Venolia

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1976_zps32ah41di.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1976_zps32ah41di.jpg.html)

Line honed the block in , thanks to Matt Shaff and Ken Nojay for pointers. Had not used this machine before.

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1765_zps5vbjftyn.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_1765_zps5vbjftyn.jpg.html)

Because of some good OT at work am upping the Crank budget and am deciding between a Bryant or Callies.
So slow but we will keep at it as possible.
Thanks for watching, BCNU
Luke

.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on June 05, 2016, 08:51:16 PM
Keep at it!
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on October 14, 2016, 07:14:25 PM
Well well well.  Its been awhile.
So when you're feeling like " Im never going to get this done".  Were all in this together. Gotta keep moving.

The Cranks here. Took longer then quoted but she's a beauty and I don't feel worthy .
 Hoping to get a bit of work done next week and will post if it happens.

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2340_zps2mjuikgg.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2340_zps2mjuikgg.jpg.html)

 ;)
BCNU
LZ
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: JrFuel Hayden on October 14, 2016, 09:27:00 PM
My experience on 12" wide rims, with the 31x12x15 D2585, and the 33x12x15, D1288 is it looks like , by looking at photos going thru the lights, is 2585's grow at least 2 , and the 1288, less, because they weigh 31 lbs, and grow less.
But I assume you are asking about tire growth  trying to figure rear gears, expected MPH, & rpm.  With looking at the RPM's , gears, & MPH, I have found that the 2585's grow a bit more, because they are lighter [ 26 lbs] and with narrower rims they also will grow more. But the bottom line when I look at my RacePak, and ET slips, it looks like if you just plug in the tire dia, ie 31" [ 2585] or 33" [1288] that the RPM is very close to the MPH when using one of the on-line formulars. My 2585's at 190 mph matches the ET slip by using tire dia of 31 1/2". Which of course doesn't make sense compared to the photos, but what we have going on is the converter slippage. So just figure 1/2" more, like 31 1/2" or 33 1/2" to figure on gears, RPM, & speed. i helped out another JF car when he was having traction problems, at the hit, with his 2585's on 11" rims, I let him use my 2585's on 12" rims, it helped, he ran a 7.04. But he did not like the 12" rims because with his 387 ci SBC, he ran lower MPH, because he couldn't pull the wider rim but he would smok'm more often. Part of the difference in our two cars combinations, is his was superlight 1355 lbs with driver [ that's why he built the smaller motor at 3.5 bls per ci] But with his motor out 50" and both of our cars had the same front axle weight, which means he was 90 lbs lighter across his rear axle = less traction. It's all about car balance.
We had two sets of 2585's one set on 11" rims, and another with 12". The 12" rims were for running in the finals at Bakersfield, when the sun was down and the track cooling off.
In our car , last time racing I had 9811 rpm @ 186.61, with 4.88 gears and 9000 stall converter, on the 31 tires on 12 rims, last year at the same track [ Sonoma] we ran 190 mph also on the 31's, 4.88, and a 8528 stall converter. So you can see the looser the converter the more slipage.
Feel free to call me if you are looking for more info/ numbers.
Jon Hansen, Hayden wheels, 800-624-3803, 805-444-4489, or jchansen60@gmail.com
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on October 22, 2016, 05:17:18 AM
My experience on 12" wide rims, with the 31x12x15 D2585, and the 33x12x15, D1288 is it looks like , by looking at photos going thru the lights, is 2585's grow at least 2 , and the 1288, less, because they weigh 31 lbs, and grow less.
But I assume you are asking about tire growth  trying to figure rear gears, expected MPH, & rpm.  With looking at the RPM's , gears, & MPH, I have found that the 2585's grow a bit more, because they are lighter [ 26 lbs] and with narrower rims they also will grow more. But the bottom line when I look at my RacePak, and ET slips, it looks like if you just plug in the tire dia, ie 31" [ 2585] or 33" [1288] that the RPM is very close to the MPH when using one of the on-line formulars. My 2585's at 190 mph matches the ET slip by using tire dia of 31 1/2". Which of course doesn't make sense compared to the photos, but what we have going on is the converter slippage. So just figure 1/2" more, like 31 1/2" or 33 1/2" to figure on gears, RPM, & speed. i helped out another JF car when he was having traction problems, at the hit, with his 2585's on 11" rims, I let him use my 2585's on 12" rims, it helped, he ran a 7.04. But he did not like the 12" rims because with his 387 ci SBC, he ran lower MPH, because he couldn't pull the wider rim but he would smok'm more often. Part of the difference in our two cars combinations, is his was superlight 1355 lbs with driver [ that's why he built the smaller motor at 3.5 bls per ci] But with his motor out 50" and both of our cars had the same front axle weight, which means he was 90 lbs lighter across his rear axle = less traction. It's all about car balance.
We had two sets of 2585's one set on 11" rims, and another with 12". The 12" rims were for running in the finals at Bakersfield, when the sun was down and the track cooling off.
In our car , last time racing I had 9811 rpm @ 186.61, with 4.88 gears and 9000 stall converter, on the 31 tires on 12 rims, last year at the same track [ Sonoma] we ran 190 mph also on the 31's, 4.88, and a 8528 stall converter. So you can see the looser the converter the more slipage.
Feel free to call me if you are looking for more info/ numbers.
Jon Hansen, Hayden wheels, 800-624-3803, 805-444-4489, or jchansen60@gmail.com

Thanks for taking time to write up and share some info Jon.
Had an interesting conversation a few weeks ago with Mike Milsap from Southwest Jr fuel assn. Nice guy.
When in our discussion we talked tires and of course your name came up ,along with the GY 2585's. (which he was also running) .  He had a set of Hoosier 31.0/12.0-15 C11 on trailer. Remembering conversation as best I can. He said that Hoosier made a few sets of these as they were trying to get a tire out to use in place of the GY 2585. He said that they were heavier then the GY but they worked well in colder conditions. Funny thing was they marked tires just as in there catalog. Did not notice any markings distinguishing these from an off shelve tire? ???. Did not ask him about what they did for his car. But he was selling them if that says something
Anyway sure will be talking to you when the time comes to replace mine.

Hey as long as I have your ear. What would be an acceptable tolerance ( spoked wheels) as far as axially in rotation ? Notice one of my hayden's wobbles a little. They came with car I bought. There beauties Jon and am honored to have them.
Guess as long as were talking, what about a runout tolerance?
Figure to log this and make it a periodic checkout.

thank you
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on December 21, 2016, 07:11:01 PM
Well Hello:
So darn hard to get your head back into the game when you have lost momentum.
But nonetheless a progress report. ;)

So decked the block yesterday. It was just a clean off and square up deal. Its proud on the deck hight but Matt said best place to start and makes sense.
Gives you room to figure head gasket and valve clearance. If we have to set her back up again no prob.

My next step would be to bore and hone. But giving work schedule ahead and using available time efficiently as possible.  Will most likely start on pan next and some odds and ends.
Will give an update soon but in case not. The Prisoner family wish all of you a fun , safe Christmas and Holiday season. Peace and health to you and yours.  :)
Luke
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2645_zpsk5h8w8qv.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2645_zpsk5h8w8qv.jpg.html)

.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on January 01, 2017, 08:35:08 PM
Hello everyone:
Let me tell a little tale(well sorry long ::)) of of some personal recollection and show a new part for the Prisoner. Not one to open up but maybe someone can relate. Pardon my Grammar.
So this nondescript little box came the day before and its another item to check off the needs list. It was a lot of money in my little world. Something I had been researching the past months for which way to go.
After making the decision last week I called someone who was an absolute cool talented guy in my eyes.
 Lets go back to a time when there were no cell phones. No computers or internet. The only way you found out what was going on with a race in a 24 hour period was if someone you knew was at the race, the old grapevine. Or the other was to wait till Tuesday when National dragster came out to get 2 week old info.
A time when Pro Comp was in full swing. There were WDRS races , divisional points with Nitro cars. A time were a family on middle class budget or a couple friends could put a Nitro car together run locally and maybe a match race. Not a top hitter but some good respectable fun.
A time were you saw a car in the ND and maybe it would be in your area at some point. It use to be neat to see a car that debuted with some new paint scheme or combo but sometimes when you saw it ,it was patched and burnt from some other race up to that point.
 I loved all facets of drag racing but near and dear to my heart was Funny Cars.
Along with that I watched all the drivers and teams with great interest. So much personality and colorful people. Everybody was dirty and amenities were scarce (well except for a few) . Like anyone though I had a few persona that caught my attention and one of those was “Wild” Wilfred Boulitier. He just seemed as he put a nice car together. Crafty low buck team. 
 Matt on here and I have been friends since grade school. While sitting at Matts house drinking mother fletchers super juice, listening to Alice Cooper and Deep Purple etc. Reading the ND to get the latest as we were heading to Reading (1975) in a few weeks we noticed in the black and white photo section a New Mustang II FC that looked really cool. It was a Cox lay down car and had the Body hung just perfectly.
Low and behold the car was at Reading and it was Wild Wilfred. Coming up on car it was like that Aaaaaaa moment when the rays of light poured down from heaven. Sitting there with its homemade window louvers and this neat “T” windshield that obviously gave you visibility. Well to this day we always talk that if we built a car that would be the model.
 Now back to the purchased part. So a few years ago read that a guy named Wilfred Boutilier started WW engineering and was making top notch Rocker systems. Had to be same guy right? Doing a little searching seen that yup it was. At time was doing a different engine and didn't need rockers. Buuuut with the change 2 years ago and started doing up the 385 series Ford that changed everything.
 The moment came last week that I called WW Engineering. Would he answer? Could I keep on task and not sound like an idiot? Would he be snooty? ( I'm a princess and wound easy) etc??
Well that all disappeared in the first 5 seconds of the call. Actually I called and left a message at first. He called me back. In those first moments I could just tell right away was talking to a caring and knowledgeable guy. He just went on without question on geometry, what to watch, what he had done with Trick Flow etc.. No pressure. Wanted to know what else I was looking at, my combo etc.. A deal was struck .
 Now while we are finishing up semantics I brought up the above story. Dang you would have thought we were friends from way back. He just opened up I couldn't believe it.  Wish so bad that Matt was on phone and I would have recorded the conversation. I literally felt like I was standing on that dusty path looking at the grass that car was on from those many years ago. He went on about all kinds of back stories with other cars and races, how he met his wife and subsequent move.
It was a real trip for me. There is just no way I have the mental competence to repeat all that was talked about with any sensibility .But will compactly recall this little bit. The Mustang II in speak here. NHRA gave him a ton of issue running the car (windshield) at Winternats debut and basically told him he couldn't pass tech. Which eventually they let him race that one time.He had many calls and threats to NHRA about how car made the rules. They finally gave in and said he could run car the season but would be rewriting the rules for next season. He did indeed do the windshield like it was for visibility. They also had scored the material along windshield line so that it would act as an escape hatch. Again compacting story.
At seasons end. He had Rusty Greer (remember that name) rework the body to meet what he was told and he hated it. To him the car was all wrong now , ugly and actually lost some MPH. Upon returning next season with car to make matters worse. They never modified rules as they said they would.
He decided to cut up body and throw away. SAD.

I opened the rockers up today and did some rough check outs. Everything looks good so far.  One nice thing (in my mind) is that these have a one pc stand for the intakes and individual exhaust stands which locate and square to location by running up against the intake stand.

Some photos attached. I will dig out one of the photos I have of the FC when get a chance for you to see.

On that note The Prisoner team wishes you all a great new year. Health and low ET’s your way.
Remember those who have passed and press on in there honor.

BCNU
Luke
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2657_zpsbwitvxoh.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2657_zpsbwitvxoh.jpg.html)
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2658_zpspfoxlwdy.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2658_zpspfoxlwdy.jpg.html)
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2666_zpseezcdjgc.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2666_zpseezcdjgc.jpg.html)

 :)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on January 01, 2017, 08:48:27 PM
Wow
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: coupemerc on January 02, 2017, 05:18:56 AM
Lots of eye candy there Luke! Nice pieces. Great story too. I remember the WW funny car. It was a BB/FC running in the old pro comp class if I remember correctly. Used to be my favorite class with the likes of Veney, Armstrong, Hall, Anderson, Williams ... Carry on!
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on April 14, 2017, 08:06:34 AM
Happy Spring everyone, well except you Southern Hemisphere friends. ;)
Yup still here plugging away as possible.
The oil pumps here and the lifters should be here in a few days. Oh Lordy those were an extreme hit to the budget for those little guys.
Am on our last big push for work the next few months so time will be at a premium.
Funny reading a thread on here about cost to run. Myself I don't think about it. Just try to set a budget and work on it. If you added up how much money, time, friends-family support to do this..........well lets not ;) ;) :o Its all about the fun.
Cant wait to let this thing eat.
Hope for a great season  for everyone. Will update work on the Prisoner as possible.
BCNU
Luke
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2953_zpsawiyzb4o.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2953_zpsawiyzb4o.jpg.html)
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on April 15, 2017, 08:49:32 AM
Did you talk to Tim Mangus about pumps?
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on May 07, 2017, 05:44:27 AM
Hey and howdy:
Well was driving home after picking this up and thinking " this has got to be the most expensive box out of anything , with relative to size and cost  :o "
But yummy Crower, thank the heavans for this item, for the Prisoner.

No Glenn I did not talk to Tim.
Going to look at laying out drive to see plausibility of driving Fuel and Oil pump off same belt.  Gotta talk to a belt manufacturer about load and belt path with respect to tensioner. Gotta plan will see how it goes.
I did get to some layout work for front plate and oil tank mount. Not easy on a FED. Trying to work hard at figuring lines. Don't want a box of extra expensive fittings that will sit in a box.

Anyway hope all y'all car plans work out and a great spring for everyone.
BCNU
Luke

(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j392/lzkustomkraft1/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2997_zpsilu4ezyp.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/lzkustomkraft1/media/The%20Prisoner/IMG_2997_zpsilu4ezyp.jpg.html)

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: coupemerc on May 07, 2017, 06:15:08 AM
Luke, Peterson makes an adapter that lets you run your fuel pump off of the back of the R4 pump. I use that on my car. If you do it that way, the engine will stop running if you ever lose the oil pump drive belt. I can send you pictures if you want.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Supercat on May 08, 2017, 07:52:12 AM
I run a fuel pump off the auxiliary drive end of our Dailey oil pump.
Works great.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on May 16, 2017, 09:00:22 PM
Hello Chuck and Cat
Yes that set up is trick and was on my mind. Thank you much for the tips.
Those Dailey pumps look to be trick pcs and love his oil air separation segment offered.
I am hoping  ::) to be able to rig a set up off of front pulley, this also gets fuel pump in a great plumbing spot and low. Plans but still have to finish measuring this out more before cutting chips .  Reason being is 2 fold. One running fuel  pump off back is space prohibitive ( remember ford) two thinking to thermally isolate the two pumps.  Just thinking as that's what I have more time for  now then  Fabing  Am sure there are surprises have not foreseen yet. Still could run pump on left side but that has its own different set of things to resolve. Trying to keep it simple can be hard hard. This could be a futile waste of time but gotta try.
My money tree will stop bearing fruit here in a couple months so will be relying on selling left over stuff collected over the years to fund the last items needed.
Or if the lottery numbers come in, in that case will be talking to Roesetty about getting a FC toghether oh yea and getting wife into a nice little house  :o
So hey we got that going for us
Thanks much guys
BCNU
Luke

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on November 25, 2017, 08:38:18 AM
Hello FED Compadres:
As you may have noticed I am one of the victims of photobuckest new photo sharing policy.
the Prisoner project will be getting some time and money available to it in January .
Looking at probably moving to Google Photos so will add link to get older photos back up and to document the upcoming work.
The reason for doing this thread is that I have myself picked up things from people and hoping that maybe by sharing I can maybe help someone back.
So with that happy Thanksgiving and or best to you .
Ignore those that try to divide us as people and keep fun in drag racing.
BCNU ;)
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on December 24, 2017, 07:39:17 AM
Hello all:
So some parts are being acquired but thats about it. On a big OT job and trying to stay on that Teat as long as its available. Should have a few  more months ???
So with that the Prisoner team family racing wishes you all a very Merry Christmas , Happy new year , or whatever else you celebrate the best for you and your family.
Best ET's safe and fun racing to be had in 2018. 8)
BCNU
Luke
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on December 24, 2017, 08:47:25 AM
Hello all:
So some parts are being acquired but thats about it. On a big OT job and trying to stay on that Teat as long as its available. Should have a few  more months ???
So with that the Prisoner team family racing wishes you all a very Merry Christmas , Happy new year , or whatever else you celebrate the best for you and your family.
Best ET's safe and fun racing to be had in 2018. 8)
BCNU
Luke

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and your family as well.
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: Frontenginedragsters on December 25, 2017, 01:26:58 PM
Need more FED's at our local track.
Lets get em' done for 2018
Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: LZ on December 24, 2018, 03:36:37 AM
Well Hey and Howdy To everyone. As long as we are at it. Merry Christmas, Happy New Year and best to whatever you practice.
Luke here, Im not dead yet. A little Prisoner post if anyones interested.

First off:
Oh this sickness we call Drag racing. We all have our life debts . Having to do your duty in some form of say taking care of a relative in need , family illness or tragedy, or just plain family commitments.  Job-income , Health , Business responsibility etc..
Just a note of solidarity to who see's this and can relate. We have all our debts in different ways. But we all share this love thats not explainable to others. We balance as best we can and move forward.

A shout out to our life partners that support us , Family and friends. Thank you all on the board, Roo , Spud, Glenn, Jon, Matt and Dan. Keep the posts coming. Many "MANY" thanks.
I look at this board everyday thats possible to see whats up.

To those that have Passed ,Via con Dios. To the survivors, Regards. 

 Finnaly looking to see that:
 its been a firkin year that last added to this :o :o 
There has been a little bit of Fab going on, very little.  Which will share eventually . Funny thing is I see that my photo bucket photos showed back up????? They reconsider ? Was looking for a new photo host when they pulled out of web hosting. Maybe will stay on photo bucket Hhmmmm....No I don't think so they pulled the plug once and can't be relied upon. So when get set on a new one will update.
We are down to last big aquisition which is the Tranny and Convertor. Then there are the never ending 100 dollar items. Plus the Truck and Trailer have been neglected. Not treated harshly just need maintanance.

With all that lets say Peace to you.
Luke
and a Monty Python bit.  ;D ;D ;D
All right ... all right ... but apart from better sanitation and medicine and education and irrigation and public health and roads and a freshwater system and baths and public order ... what have the Romans ever done for us?.
.

Title: Re: the Prisoner
Post by: GlennLever on December 24, 2018, 08:39:13 AM
Merry Christmas.