Author Topic: 6 cyl k88 style questions  (Read 1503 times)

Offline Goinbroke2

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6 cyl k88 style questions
« on: February 15, 2018, 06:26:50 PM »
Kid finished with the junior last year, wants to go big car this year. My mustangs not ready and won't be due to a million things.

Then the fed bug hit and I can't get it out of my mind. Have a 4cyl FED as a screenshot on my computer now. lol.

So, short wheelbase 100-125"
300/c4/9"
k88 type or something similar

what weight would I be at? (approx. obviously)
How much power will I need, pro class is 11:50 - 13.50. Don't want to go faster (super pro) as that's our electronics class.

Yes I've built a poop load of race engines, have tube benders/mig/tig/engine building tooling/etc
Thinking 230*@.050 cam/4bbl/porting and head work, just a mild torque engine max at 5500-6000.
3000stall converter and I have everything from 3:00-3:50-4:11 and 4:86 gearsets

Am I out to lunch or have any semblance of logic here?

Offline Goinbroke2

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2018, 06:29:08 PM »
Forgot to add I have a 54 dodge front axle I was thinking of using unless you guys think a round tube axle would be better/lighter/etc?

Offline denverflatheader

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2018, 07:17:58 AM »
Goinbroke2 - posting in Six Cylinder section so we assume 300/c4/9” means engine is a Ford 300 six.  I’ve read before the stock 1960s Ford 300 six weighs less than a stock 1960s sbc.  The c4 weighs more than a pg, perhaps your engine/trans combo will weigh similar to a sbc with pg in race trim.  Weight guess without driver, 1250lbs with that solid 54 Dodge axle.
 
If you have the 54 Dodge axle and associated parts (i.e. spindles, wheels, steering) in good usable condition, move forward with that choice.  That’s how things were done back in the day and will make your K88 replica more yours and more distinct.  Like a bad puzzle, up to you to make it work well and look attractive.  When others are checking it out, could be a reflection of how much talent you have or don’t have : )

The stock and/or slightly modified Ford 300 six isn’t a high rpm engine.  With your planned engine modifications, close to one hp per cubic inch is possible.

A 3000 stall convertor is probably on the light side, your modified engine/trans combination might enjoy a higher; like 4500-4800 rpm stall convertor to help you achieve that 11.50-13.50 et.  With a c4 trans and 2.46 low gear, I’d select a 3.70-3.90 rear gear ratio with a 29 inch tall rear slick to start.  After a few passes, you will know what to change the rear gear ratio to permanently.  Alan


Offline Goinbroke2

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2018, 08:41:57 PM »
Thanks for the reply!
Yes 300 ford six. 1250# great, that’s a general idea I can work with. Not being a rpm fan I was thinking 6000 would be max(if that, depends on head flow) regardless, I have something to work with.

Ran a very successful 300/e4od/8.8 f150 in Street class years ago and was very impressed with its consistency. I’ve got a 302 crate engine as well as a couple 460’s if I wanted to go faster, but bracket racing this six would be different and fun.

Thanks again for the reply, time to crunch some numbers.

Offline Goinbroke2

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2018, 08:43:22 AM »
No comments since Feb?...

Anyway, worked all summer and never even hit the track until Aug. Been out twice now with my younger kid driving my older kids focus, just to get on the track.
Mustang will be worked on this winter but kid is really liking the look of a fed so we'll see how it goes. New garage in the process of being built, man life gets in the way don't it??

Same plan...7 months later...a few more parts acquired...

Offline gregm784

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2018, 11:36:19 AM »
Any pics?
Greg
El Dorado County, CA
www.meansracing.com

Offline THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2018, 08:41:48 AM »
OK

I am about to become your "go to" guy.

That's because I have a small fleet of Ford six powered race cars and hot rods.

My avatar car (blue altered) runs a built 300 with a crossflow six - runs 9.0s @ 147 in Super Pro.

My Logghe altered (orange car) is run at vintage / nostalgia races a few times a year. It weighs almost 1800# with me in it (225#) and runs low-to-mid tens. It has run 9.7 in the past but I slowed it down to above 9.99 sec so I don't have to jump through the chassis cert hoops any more for the car since it only gets raced three or four times a year.

 But the most relevant car in my fleet is probably my Frenchtown Family Truckster. I built it to potentially run Super Street (10.90 index) but only bracket race it now. Here are some specs:

weight: 2150# (car and driver) w/ 70 lbs of ballast.
2.47! gears in a 9" rear. My plan was to switch to 4.56 gears for Super Street. 12" or 10.5" slicks
300 six, flat top pistons, bracket / circle track roller cam, dual quad intake w/ two tiny Autolite 2-Vs totaling 340 cfm equivalent 4V flow,
rollerized valve train, big valve ported head, stud girdle.
Powerglide 2-speed w/ 1.82 low gearset
4000 rpm stall 8" Coan converter

Even with the 2.47 rear gears and the tiny carbs it will run 11.90s on the hand brake or 11.60s on the trans brake, shifting the car at 5000 - 5500. On pump gas. I highly recommend the Powerglide over the C4. [There are valid reasons why most serious bracket race cars use Powerglides and 9" Ford rear ends, for that matter]
I recommend making the wheelbase 125" so the crushing torque of this engine does not overwhelm a too-short chassis. It can still look old-ish at 125". Also I'd use a stall speed of at least 4000 RPM. And build the chassis to cert for 9.99 and save yourself headaches in the tech line.

A 300 six with iron manifolds weighs 490# dry.

Check out the website www.fordsix.com for great advice. Good luck with your project.





« Last Edit: September 26, 2018, 09:08:24 AM by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER »

Online opa1

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2018, 01:32:59 PM »
That orange machine looks nice!!!  It's giving me ideas. :)

Mark

Offline THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2018, 07:38:01 PM »
Thanks Mark. That is actually the last altered built at the famed Logghe Stamping Company. I am the original and sole owner. It has always had a six cylinder engine. Chuck Kurzawa, noted Top Fuel builder did the welding when he worked at Logghe. Al Bergler did the tin work. In 2000 I crashed the car at Norwalk and it sat for 11 years until I collected enough parts to have the car front-halfed at Advanced Chassis in Antwerp Ohio.

Offline denverflatheader

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Re: 6 cyl k88 style questions
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2018, 08:23:05 AM »
FTF – pretty nifty collection you’ve built/put together, I enjoyed reading the story on the Logghe Stamping altered.  Here’s pictures I took at Garlits museum in 2013.  Both are Fords, an inline 6 and a V8 flathead.  The “Fly” has unusual racing parts per the description, a Crane Super Port cylinder head with Lucas Maserati Injection and Hilborn stacks.  Don said Bradley’s dragster, a V8 flathead D class is similar weight to the “Fly” dragster.

Goinbroke2 - look at the printed weight of the "Fly" dragster on the display board.  Alan